Interview

Interview with 5th Rangers Veteran

The following is an interview through email with Thomas Herring, a veteran of the 5th Ranger Battalion. He was most kind to answer a list of questions I had.

Dear Mr. Herring, My research has found a lot of information about general movements, battles, results, etc., about the Rangers, as is typical of most WWII history. However, it seems to me a lot of details are either assumed or deemed unimportant. My goal is to bring out as much of the detail of this time as possible, so as to get a real feel for the day to day life and concerns of the individual Ranger. Feel free to skip any questions, I know there are a lot of them, or to add whatever you think is important that I might have omitted. Please take your time, there is no deadline for a response.

For the record, please state your name, rank, unit, and dates of service.

Thomas E. Herring; PVT, CPL, SGT, PVT; 501 Parachute Regiment, 26th INF DIV, 5th RGR BN; November 1942 to 20 February 1945 (Medical discharge)

Uniforms:

What are your opinions of the uniform you were issued?

They served their purpose. They were what the Army issued - we had nothing to say about that.

In the field, was there laundry service, or other ways to get them clean?

In combat, we wore them without washing, except for an occasional wash of underwear. When they got really cruddy, we were usually re-issued clean uniforms. Of course, while in camps in U.S. and England, there were weekly laundry provided.

What was the availability of showers or other bathing facilities?

In combat zone, we usually availed ourselves of the streams for such use - and an occasional swim. Periodically, we were "treated" to a shower via a transportable shower facility handled by the QM Corps and a change of clothing. I think in the 6 months I was in combat zone, we got this about twice!!!

When rotated out of the line, were you generally issued new uniforms, or were the ones you had cleaned?

Depended upon where we were and how long we were anticipated to be "out of the line." See above comments about unforms.

Did uniforms change as time went on, or were they pretty much the same throughout the war?

The only changes I saw was some of the "late arrivals" were issued "Ike jackets" (I never got one ) and the canvas leggings were done away with after the Normandy invasion.

What are you opinions of the German uniforms, particularly the parachute (Fallshirmjager) and SS camouflaged uniforms?

From what I saw, the officers were usually well dressed, while the troop's uniforms were sloppy.

Did you feel the German uniforms, particularly the camouflaged ones, put American soldiers at a disadvantage or did it matter?

I never saw a German camoflage uniform - heard about them but never saw one.

Were American soldiers issued any kind of white winter camouflaged gear, did they make their own, or did they bother? Were the German soldiers issued white winter gear, did it put American soldiers at a disadvantage?

I never saw this in U.S. Army - I left at the start of the Battle of the Bulge. I have heard of American troops "liberating" bedsheets for such use. What the Germans were issued, I have no knowledge.

Weapons:

What are you opinions about the M1 Garand? What percentage (roughly) of Rangers used them?

The Garand was an asset with the 8 shot clip and rapid fire ability. All riflemen used the Garand except our snipers. Ammo bearers usually had a Garand. As a mortar gunner, I used the .45 pistol.

What are your opinions of the M1 Carbine? What percentage (roughly) of Rangers used them? Did they use the M1 Carbine, the full-auto M2 Carbine, or both?

I persoanlly liked the Carbine - bought one after the war! Most officers carried the carbine (some carried submachine guns). I understand that only paratroopers had the full-auto fire carbines. My personal opinion is that the auto-fire feature wasted bullets.

What are your opinions of the Thompson submachine gun? What percentage (roughly) of Rangers used them? Which version did the Rangers used?

I personally thought he Thompson was too heavy. We did carry them on a few raids where we were to shoot up a place. Most platoon Sgts carried the Thompson, so did some of the officers. We used what we were issued - model unknown.

What are your opinions of the M3 "grease gun"? What percentage (roughly) of Rangers used them? Sources state that they came with a 9mm conversion kit, was this ever used?

Never used one - occasionally saw some of the later troops with them. I know of no Ranger who liked the grease gun - preferred the Thompson. I am unaware of the 9mm version.

What are your opinions of the 1903a4 sniper rifle? Sources state that there was one sniper per platoon, is this accurate? How were snipers selected, and did they receive any specialized training or other equipment?

I liked to '03 - qualified Expert with it, best with Garand was Marksman. In the 5th RGR BN we had a sniper with each platoon. They were usually used as riflemen except for those "rare" occasions when they had to get a German sniper. In our platoon, the sniper was selected from a riflemen who was an expert shot. I know of no other specialized effects for them.

Were any non-sniper 1903 Springfield rifles issued to Rangers? What percentage (roughly) of Rangers used them?

When the battalion was first formed, we were issued '03s. About a month later, they were exchanged for Garands - WWII supply problems!

What are your opinions about the 1911a1 colt .45 pistol? What percentage (roughly) of Rangers used them?

I liked the Colt .45 very much. I happened to be one of the few who was an expert shot with it and very fast on the draw. I had pistol training in Junior NRA before the war so was better than most with the pistol. I once won a sizable bet, in England, when I fired 5 shots at a silhouette target some 200 yards away and hit it 4 times in the chest area. I could draw the .45 and get off 5 shots in less than 20 seconds. Most of the guys thought the .45 was useless and did not carry it.

Sources state that both the BAR 1918a2 and the Browning 1919a6 machine guns were used as squad/Platoon automatic weapons, which is true, or if both were used, roughly what percentage of both? What are your opinions about these weapons?

I only recall our machine guns being Browning Light Machinegun - I don't know the model. We had two machinegun squads in the weapons platoon. They were frequently used in combat - even went of patrols. The light mg was very portable and could be fired without a tripod by supporting the barrel in the left hand (this was done on D-Day when a tripod was lost coming ashore).

About how many hand grenades per Ranger were taken into battle, both fragmentation and smoke? How did the American grenades compare to the German ones?

It was usually the individual's decision as to the number. We usaually had one smoke grenade for marking targets for planes. Most of the guys carried at least 3 frag grenades, some a few more. The German grenades were easier to throw due to their "handle." I felt the U.S. grenades were better fragmentation and covered a greater space than the German "potato masher."

Sources state that the Bazooka anti-tank weapon performed poorly against the heavier German tanks, is this true? How about their light-medium armored cars/tanks, was it effective against those? How many were issued to a platoon/company? How many rockets was a standard combat load?

Our bazookas were useless against the heavy tanks, so we resorted to firing at the treads to disable them - somewhat effective. We were trained to get atop a tank and throw a grenade into the hatch when it was opened for air. Bazookas were very effective against machinegun crews and, in some cases, snipers. I recall we had 4 bazookas in the Company. I recall that the "bazooka pack," carried by the #2 man, had 6 shells in it.

Which weapon(s) did you personally use?

As mentioned above, the .45 pistol.

Did the Rangers use captured German equipment, or receive any training on German weapons?

Yes. Once we ran out of ammo and resorted to German small arms. However, we very quickly discovered that adjacent U.S. troops, recognizing the sound of German weapons, fired upon us so we no longer used German weapons.

What are your opinions about the German Kar98k rifle, FG-42 rifle, MP40 submachine gun, stg44 assault rifle, MG34 and MG42 machine guns, Panzershrek and Panzerfaust anti-tank weapons?

Any weapon shooting at you is dangerous and serves its purpose. I personally have no knowledge of the German weapons other than to hear and see them in action in combat.

Did you find any Germans using captured American/British weapons, if so, which ones?

No.

Were the Rangers trained on any British weapons, if so what are your opinions about them?

The only British weapon we trained with was the Boys Anti-Tank Rifle. .55 caliber and could penetrate more than an inch of steel. It was fired from the prone position (due to its recoil) and no one liked to fire it because you were sore for several days afterward.

Units:

What are your opinions of the other Ranger battalions? Did you get to interact/ communicate with them, or were the missions such as to keep them separated?

Veterans of the 1st Ranger Bn helped with our training in the U.S. but, otherwise, we had no future contact with them. Prior to the invasion, our Battalion C.O. was replaced by a 1st Bn veteran of 4 invasion in Africa and Italy. He was good, well-liked by the troops. and knew what to do at the right time. We took part in one exercise in England with the 2nd Bn but that was all. In France, we fought alongside the 2nd Bn on D-Day and in some of the Brest Campaign. Other than that, we went our separate ways. The 1st, 3rd, and 4th were deactivated just before D-Day. The 6th Bn served in the Pavcific area.

What are you opinions of the British units, Did you get to interact with them, or were the missions such as to keep them separated?

We trained with the British Commando in England and Scotland. Our landing craft were the property of and operated by the Royal Navy. All the British troops we had contact with were good soldiers, knew their business, and proved very helpful to us. Our units are still friends with the British Commando and some of the Royal Navy to this day. Both have attended our reunions in the U.S. and, when we go to England, they always turn out in force to welcome and host us.

What are your opinions of the various German units that were engaged? Was there a great deal of difference between a regular (Heer) army unit, the paratroopers (Fallshirmjager), Waffen-SS, or Mountain troops?

On the invasion, and through most of France, we found the German ranks made up of conscripts from other countries - most of whom had no desire to fight. Some of these units were officered by paratroop officers, and an occasional SS officer, who were responsible to "make the troops fight." On more than one instance, we found that the troops had slain their officers so they could surrender. As we neared the German border, we found more Germans in the troops and even some of the Hitler Youth units - both were a little more eager to fight for their country.

Sources state that Ranger units were occasionally tasked with guarding prison camps. Was this easy duty, or were there escape attempts?

About mid-June 1944, the 5th Bn was charged with running a POW camp for the Germans surrendering in Normandy and Cherbourg, We manned the camp until a MP unit arrived in France and took over. One of our tasks was to march groups of 100 prisoners to the beach for the boat ride to England. We used 4 Rangers for this purpose. Before the group departed for the beach, the officer on duty would address the Rangers stating, each was armed with Thompsons and if anyone slowed, dropped out, or attempted escape, they were to shoot immediately. We never lost a prisoner. A few days after the MPs took over, they used 10 to 15 men to accompany the prisoners. Several times they had several Germans escape from them.

Do the Ranger battalions have reunions? About how often? Do any Ranger vveterans have contact with German veterans, if so from which units?

The Ranger Battalions Assn-WWII holds biennial reunions in the odd-numbered years. This year's will be in Minneapolis in late August. I am unaware of any contact with units of German veterans. Some Germans moved to the U.S. after the war. I personally know three with whom I have been friendly (and a couple more whom I detest). We have discussed the war on occasion - but not in the last several years.

Communication/support:

Which radios were issued to the Rangers (handy talky, walky talky)? What are you opinions of them? Did they function well? What were the backup methods of communication if the radios failed?

We had the "handy talkies," and the "back pack" (don't know models, etc.) The "handy talkies" were usually not worth the effort. In those days, they used batteries and wiring which, when wet, would not function. On the invasion I don't recall a single radio in our unit that functioned ashore. On occasion we had problems with the "back pack" radios but not as often. Backup for a failed radio was the human runner.

What was the general amount of artillery/air support that could be expected when there was a need? Were there assigned people who were tasked to call for support, or was every Ranger trained to call as needed? Was the support accurate, or were there problems with friendly-fire casualties?

Support depended upon where we were and where the support was. When available we could get artillery and air support in a short time. We had artillery "observers" with us, or nearby, most of the time, or the C.O. could call for support. Once we needed air cover for a raid that was stopped by enemy fire. The C.O. radioed England which relayed the need to an AAF unit in France and within minutes we had 3 P-47s strafing and bombing the target. I don't recall any "friendly fire casualties," but there were some close calls.

There are conflicting sources regarding company-level mortars, were they 60mm or 81mm? About how many rounds were carried for each? What are your opinions of either one of these weapons?

In the 5th Bn each company had three 60mm mortar squads. For the invasion, it was felt heavier support was needed so "C" Company was designated as the "weapons company" and we carried 81mm mortars in. Shortly after the invasion was successful, we "traded" in the 81s for the TO&E 60s. Each 60mm squad had 3 ammo bearers who carried 6 or 8 shells each. The assistant gunner also carried 4 to 6 shells. As an expert mortar gunner, I felt the mortar was a great weapon - accurate, rapid rate of fire (we frequently could set up and have 5 shells in the air in under one minute) and effective up to 1500 yards. We fired at targets as close as 300 yards but didn't like to.

How was the medical care in general? About how many medics and/or doctors were there on a squad/platoon/company/battalion level? What were the biggest problems illness wise, non-combat injury, combat injury? Were the medical units well supplied? Were medics/doctors armed, and with what weapon(s)?

Having availed myself of medical attention, I feel the care was first-rate. Our medics were dedicated in their work and most of them almost fearless in the face of battle. We suffered some cold weather illnesses (I had double pneumonia three times), frost bite, accidental shootings and combat injuries. Medical supplies were adequate- we each carried a small "first aid pack." I know of no medical personnel who carried arms - that was against the Geneva Convention!

Was food ever a problem? Was there enough, was it of good quality? Were there cooks attached to the Ranger battalions, or was food prepared by support units? Were there any cases of food poisoning? When on the line, what percentage of the time was hot food served as opposed to k/c rations? What is your opinion of the k/c rations?

On a rare occasion, in combat zone, we ran out of food for a short time (maybe a meal or two). We ate mostly K- and C-rations in the combat zone. A couple of times when we were "out of the line" for an extended period, we set up the kitchen and had 3 hot meals daily. In combat, we liked to "live off the land" - taking whatever was handy and that usually proved to be "good eating" - fruit, vegetables, rabbits, chickens, eggs, fresh milk, and an occasion veal steak - much to the chagrin of the farmers!!!! Rangers had their own "kitchen staff" who, when we went into combat, became riflemen. I recall July 4 1944, the C.O. sent the mess sgt out for some "special food" for the occasion. We had delicious steaks and fresh vegetables and baked potato that day!!! I am unaware of any food poisoning being endured. K- and C-rations were a necessity in combat. However, when the 10-in-1s became available, that was like a gourmant dinner!!!!

Religion, about what percentage of Rangers were Protestant, Catholic, Jewish, other? How many chaplains were there in each battalion? Were religious differences ever an issue?

We had a chaplain which we shared with the 2nd Rgr Bn - he was a Catholic priest but knew all the religion's needs - protestant, Hebrew, etc. He was well-liked and also a brave man - providing last rites while under enemy fire without a flinch. No one seemed to care about what religion you were - I recall in Scotland one Sunday, we went to an Anglican service with Catholics, Protestants, and Hebrews in our group.

What were the favorite songs of the time? What was your favorite song?

Most anyhting that Miller and Dorsey played. I still listen to their music.

Was there a Ranger song or cadence? Would you write down the words, as well as you can remember?

Most of our songs were made up by the guys and are unprintable. They insulted almost everybody. We were at Camp Kilmer, NJ awaiting shipment overseas and we would sing our ditties while marching in formation around the area. The camp C.O. ordered our C.O. to avoid future use of such songs - they offended the females and the civilians.

Perception:

If you saw the movies "Saving Private Ryan" or "Band of Brothers", what would you say the most realistic parts were? The least realistic parts?

In SPR, to me, the most realistic part was the invasion - only the real invasion was about 10 times worse! The rest was pure garbage - Rangers did not react that way with each other. I watched three episodes of BOB and watched no more - found it too "hollywood." This is my opinion.

What do you think the current generation least understands about WWII and what the American infantryman had to go through?

Not too much - most of them are used to the "easy life." We have a Sons & Daughters group in RBA who are continually amazed to hear the various stories. Most of them had no idea of what happened in WWII - their fathers did not talk about it to them. Several of the S&Ds have been modern-day Rangers so they have a concept of WWII.

Please share any stories about any subject from that time, if you wish.

I tell people, "I don't tell stories, I answer questions!"

Below are a several follow up questions I had for Mr. Herring, and his responses.

Dear Mr. Herring,
I am very deeply appreciative for your response to my list of questions. It turns out that a lot of what I assumed was incorrect, and a few sources I relied on were not so reliable. Thank you. I found your service record to be intriguing, and would like to ask if you could expand on it. What did you do prior to your service?

I attended highschool, graduating in June 1942. I worked in the first supermarket store (new concept at that time) warehouse in Miami, FL. In November, several of my buddies and I decided we would not await the draft and enlisted. We planned on Army Air Corps gunnery school but in the enlistment office I read a sign, "Earn $50 a month more! Join the paratroopers." Having been raised in an economically strained family (my fsather had died in 1936) that was a lot of money to me. So, when my turn came and was asked, "What do you want to join?" I said, "Paratroopers." I had never flown at that time, but had built model planes and sometimes cleaned real planes for a local charter service.

Were you drafted or volenteered?

See above.

Were you first in the 501 Parachute regiment? What was that like?

I left the induction center - Camp Blanding, FL - and went to Camp Toccoa, GA where the 501 was to train. This was the "new" 501, not the original 501 Parachute Battalion that trained in Panama to determine if paratroopers were viable to the Army. As I recall, none of the guys at Toccoa had jumped before - except the officers - so I guess they were there for reasons similar to mine. Toccoa is in the N.Georgia mountains, so it was cold in winter, and frequently snowed. We trained anyway, learning to jump from practice towers, long cross-sountry marches, rifle shooting, etc. Each morning we made a three-mile run around the camp. I contracted pneumonia in late January 1943 - the doctor told me it was breathing the cold humid air that melted in my lungs forming moisture, etc. Anyway, I was laid up for two weeks so I missed two weeks of valuable (they said) training and so was transferred out. Of possible interest - when we were in England awaiting the invasion, I was walking down the street of the local town and a voice from across the street yelled my name. I looked at him, a paratrooper, and it was one of my former hut mates at Toccoa - they were in the same marshalling area as the Rangers. He took me to their encampment and most of my former hut mates and the first sergeant welcomed me like a lost brother. Unfortuantely, most of them were killed during the invasion jump.

Did you then transfer to 26th, why was that? And what was that unit like?

The 26th Inf Div was a Massachusetts Nat'l Guard unit, called to service in 1941 prior to Pearl Harbor. To the officers and non-coms, the "troops" were "garbage" and verbally abused. The "leaders" would not listen to anyone. I had never experienced such and, of course, did not like it. I was always in trouble because of my mouth. I was a good soldier but "mouthy." I volunteered for any unit that was posted on the bulletin board. I was offered the chance for Officer Candidate School but refused when I was told I would return to the 26th. When asked why I refused, I told them, and the interviewer was somewhat disturbed by my "attitude." The 26th went from Ft. Jackson, SC to Camp Gordon, GA. At Gordon, it was posted that the Rangers were looking for men. I signed up. All my sgts said I wouldn't be accepted. When they got my records to submit to the Rangers, they were astounded that my I.Q. was so much higher than theirs - one of the reasons I was offered OCS. Of the 5 men from from my company in the 26th, I was the only one accepted by the Rangers.

I see that you're rank went up to Sergeant, then back to private, did you give up your stripes to be in the Rangers, why, and was that a common thing?

When I entered the Rangers, I was a PFC. In the Rangers I was assigned to be a mortar gunner (as I had been in the 26th). In the Rangers that was a Corporal. In France, I was promoted to squad leader - sergeant. About a week later, I mouthed off to some newly arrived OCS grad about how stupid he was and I, for one, wouldn't follow him anywhere. I was busted to Private. I made up my ,ind to bne a Private from then on. Every time it was mentioned I would be promoted, I refused it. One thing - I was so proficient as mortar gunner, that I remained gunner even as a Private! As for the OCS Lt., he later led a patrol and, disobeying oprders not to fight is vhallenged, he did so anyway amd got two machine gun squads killed and the rest of the patrol wounded. The company commander got the report upon their retunr and told the Lt., "Get out of my company area. If I ever lay eyes on you again, I'll kill you on sight!" We never di know what happened to the Lt., no one seemed to have seen him after that threat!

Was your service unique (moving between units) or was that normal for the Army of that time?

I would say it depended upon the individual. Some of them seemed to "happy" where they were and acceopted things as they came. All the Rangers seemed to have joined for the same reason - to get out of the "chicken-shit" outfit they were in. In the Rangers, you were treated as men, were a part of all planning, were respected by the officers (even if you had a big mouth!) and the guys enjoyed each others company. Today, veterans of all 6 WWII Ranger Battalions get together periodically and are all good friends, reagrdless of which battalion you were in. Of interest - when we were in the last marshalling area - confined there under penalty of being shot if you went out - they had a briefing of the invasion pertaining to the early waves of the invasion. The briefing was for officers - major and up - but the Rangers attended en ,masse, much to the consternation of the officers of other units! The main reason for all Rangers to be "in on the planning" is that we trained to carry on the mission until the last man! So, if you did not know the details, you could not do that. I know of no other unit who had such a task.

What decorations, if any, did you receive?

Besides the Theater of Opeartions medals/ribbons & Good Conduct medal, I was awarded the Combat Infantryman's Badge, the Bronze Star, The WII Victory Medal..The 5th Battalion was awarded the French Croix de Guerre.

What did you do after your discharge?

My best highschoool buddy's father was Chief of Customs for the Port of Miami, FL. Due to the war, they always needed men, so he hired me on. I worked as Customs Inspector until January 1946 when I entered the Univ. of Fla. on the GI Bill. Studied Civil Engineering. Worked for the Road Dept of Fla as an engineer; Navy Bureau of Yards and Docks as a Construction Engr; with consulting engineers designing highways and, in 1955, went with an internationl construction company where I retired after 35 years - having been field engineer, chief engineer, superintendent, project manager, construction manager, chief estimator and, finally, corporate estimating manager.

Also, one last question regarding weapons: Sources are contradictory as to the use of shotguns as an issued weapon, were they used to your knowledge?

In the Rangers, we were trained to use the shot gun. Purpose was for raids that required a dispersement of pellets to take the biggest toll. I do not recall that we ever used the shot gun in combat - for any purpose.